NUFC in Europe?

Posted on February 29th, 2012 | 43 Comments |

Toon in Europe?
Toon in Europe - Be careful what you wish for?
Ok. So at this point, with 12 games of the season left and 43 points, we are looking to head to Europe; although that could tempt the “Be careful what you wish for” saying.

The squad we currently have is most certainly unable to cope with so many games in such little time if we were to get to the Europa League. Maybe we would follow the same route as Spurs, play almost a reserve team and ‘concentrate on the league,’ but that would be a waste of a flight, wouldn’t it? But is the Europa League good for us? Because after all, its second best, like the League Cup. Would we get any money from it? Not a great deal probably. We would have to somehow get the money to buy in a lot of good players (not just satisfactory) to strengthen the team during the Summer, because put simply, Perch, Williamson and Guthrie aren’t good enough.

But then comes the need for Europe – Demba Ba, Colo and more are never going to stay if we dont get there. So it is important that we do in some shape or form because there is even the big one to mention, the Champion’s League. If we got there, Ashley wouldn’t need to graffiti the stadium with his blue and red tack because we would be in the money and happy for once. We would have the money to buy in backup players, and contract problems – What are they? So, you see where I’m going, we have to get to the Champion’s League this season or never, well, 10 years time.

The chances we get into Europe this season are high. Chelsea look hopeless right now and things on and beyond the pitch just aren’t going good for them at the moment. Arsenal are the same, I can’t see their defence keeping another clean sheet this season. Yes they just killed Spurs 5-2 (to the pleasure of the larger percentage of the toon who dislike ‘Arry), but truly their woeful performances in matches before outweigh that. They aren’t ever going to be like the “Invincibles” again. They are pretty much a one man team, but, that one man is better than Batman when he is on form! That would be the only reason they would finish 4th – Robin Van Persie and their +16 goal difference. Then comes the daft scousers – I’d rather walk alone. They are already in Europa after their League Cup performance. I loved Stevie Gee’s face when he missed his penna! So where I’m going is, even if we finish 6th, if it is a Spurs v Liverpool final of the FA cup, we are still in with a chance.

The ‘must’ of this season is the Europa League, the ‘should’ is the Champion’s League. I can see us getting at least 21 more points this season, but concentrating on one match at a time, next match being the Mackems at home. That should be interesting! However Pardew does it, 3 points is a must. This time next week we could be in ecstasy like the 1st of November 2010, the day after the demolition derby; or just elated, like the 21st of August 2011, the day after Ryan Taylor over the wall. Either way it’s a 6 points party. Super Senegalese Sunday the sequel? Bend it like Taylor? The curly one strikes again? All aboard the dreamboat? Boom Cheik Cheik the room? Shola? Hatembomb? We will see!

Howay The Lads!

Oh! and at 13 mins on Saturday the entire 52,000 singing ‘Stand Up for St James’ Park’ was momentous. Make it a tradition. #StJamesParkForever.



NUFCBlog Author: weyayecabaye Toon blogger, fan, season ticket holder.... you better follow me @maria_nufc ST JAMES' PARK FOREVER! weyayecabaye has written 1 articles on this blog.

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43 Responses

  1. According to UEFA the fixed payments for the 2010/2011 UEFA Europa League season were as follows, 1st qualifying round: €90,000 2nd qualifying round: €90,000 3rd qualifying round: €90,000 Playoffs: €90,000 Group stage: €640,000 For each match in group stage: €60,000 Group match victory: €140,000 Group match draw: €70,000 Round of 32: €200,000 Round of 16: €300,000 Quarter-finals: €400,000 Semi-finals: €700,000 Losing Finalist: €2,000,000 Winning the Final: €3,000,000

    add the ticket receipts and media revenue to that along with possible shirt sales etc from the club being in the spotlight,
    …just so you know.

  2. yes, well, mmm. I asked this question last week and got some excellent detailed answers
    – my conclusion was that the cost & disruption of a one season campaign in the euro league would be negative, but if (if) we could step up in class to qualify several years running (even if still 5-7th in the PL) then it would be the proper way for us to develop & progress.

    To achieve this we need at least 3 quality players – and at the moment (from the press rumours) we are looking at some decent buys all within our budget – so it could work out well.

    If we get it wrong the I fear another Richard Dinnis fiasco – I saw us knocked out of EUEFA Cup by Bastia (Johnny Rep wonder goal) at SJP followed by a pathetic league run & relegation. As a squad we were out of our depth.

    On balance I’d say invest & go for it! But would Big Brother see it that way?

  3. and it occurs to me – I assume being in Europe would make NUFC more attractive to a buyer – any ideas what offers Big Brother would accept?

    On the other hand – is europe a big or attractive market for Sports Direct making a euro TV campaign a profitable advertising prospect? – i.e. is football or shirt sales the main issue?

  4. I must admit that i would love NUFC in europe but crnt help but feel our league position next season would slip. MA wont spend alot of money buying in new players to be able to cope with demand of all these games.
    On the other hand finish 4th and get champions league he may well have to. Good money coming in tv apperence and so forth.

    Derby game the big 1 for me if we win i feel we could progress and maybe just maybe make champions league. Lose (not worth thinking about) and think we will struggle to even make europe.

    3-1 TOON on sunday.

  5. Afternoon folks!

    To me the worst case scenario would be getting into the Champions League, Scrooge spending peanuts on some young frogs in his inimitable “buy one get one free” style, then getting drawn against Barcelona.

    Lets break that down…….

    Champions League Qualification – *possible but scary*

    Scrooge spending peanuts etc….*highly likely whatever happens*

    Getting drawn against Barcelona *possible and extremely scary*

    The UTD111 conclusion: We’ve been accused of “punching above our weight” this season by such intellectual giants as Paul Merson and Knacker Lawrenson. One thing is for sure – we would be twonked by most Champions League Teams – so that’s a low score on the desirability-o-meter :(

  6. i think it would be great to get into Europe, in terms of our squad, maybe i dont see it like everyone else but i really dont think it is that weak in terms of depth for second rate competition (the league is a different story).

    if you go through it position by position and include some of the youngsters (who will benefit most from playing in europe anyway) i only think we need two or three additions in the summer (assuming no-one leaves) i dont think any of our best players should be used in the europa league and it would by no-means be a priority but i think it would be a good chance to give the fringe/young players a run out like: foster, kadar, taviner, ferguson, vukic, gosling, sammy, ben arfa, shola, best

    which looking at it still leaves the full first team not to be used plus the two or three signings you would expect us to make in the summer.

  7. First of all, welcome to the blog weyayecabaye.

    I appreciate your optimism on several fronts, but I’m not sure it will work that way. For a start:

    “If we got there, Ashley wouldn’t need to graffiti the stadium with his blue and red tack because we would be in the money and happy for once.”

    Champion’s League exposure would be another reason for Ashley to take things even further on the Sports Directification front. Supermac asked above:

    “i.e. is football or shirt sales the main issue?”

    It’s shirt sales. Newcastle United is very much second fiddle for Ashley, and he doesn’t really want to sell on the naming rights and put up all of those dreadful signs to raise money for players. He wants it to promote Sports Direct and Europe, especially the CL, would be a big bonus for him in terms of exposure for his brand overseas.

    I also think that we would be too one dimensional tactically to get too far in Europe. Our direct style has served us well so far much of the time in the Premiership so far, but it would be found out by the bigger teams in Europe.

    You have a point that we would need to have a deeper squad if we were to take things seriously, but on the other hand, Jamie also has a point that it would be good experience for our youngsters. Looking on the dark side, it would also be another good shop window for Ashley’s footballer farm project, a further opportunity to showcase his players to sell on at a profit.

    I followed Chris Hughton’s European adventure with Birmingham City. He lost well over a dozen of his top players, but he embraced it as a way of bringing his less experienced players through the ranks even though they were never going to win it and it almost certainly hindered their League performance in the earlier part of the season, it was good for the long term development of the squad. I think they’ve played more games than any other team this season?

  8. Not buying any of those bloody flapjacks, i meant choke on one & die. I’ve stopped crossing roads too.
    Too scary!

  9. Unlikely !
    Yeah we are in sixth place i know, but a lack of quality in depth and a manager who is clueless from a tactical viewpiont, plus we lack a decent CD to compliment Colo.
    For this side to qualify for either tournament on a regular basis, requires at least a half dozen decent signings and a clearout of the deadwood.
    It’s not all doom and gloom however, there is the basis in place for a decent side, if we can hold onto everyone.
    A decent right winger (Jr. Hoilett ?)
    A top central defender.
    Two decent fullbacks.
    But apparently we are looking at center midfielders, go figure ?
    We couldda had Vertonghen for the price we paid fo Cisse, but appears he is now set on a move to Spurs.
    With a clearout of, Loenkrands,Perch,Williamson,Smith and possibly Gosling and Guthrie (the latter two for inconsistency) thats six out and six in.
    But Rome was,nt built in a day so dont expect it to happen.

  10. CLiNT FLiCK says:
    February 29, 2012 at 3:08 pm

    “I’ve stopped crossing roads too.
    Too scary!”

    You should try crossing the roads in Saigon Clint, then NW would be a piece of piss. When I used to go there, there was a city of several million in a tiny space, a couple of million Honda Dreams and only two sets of traffic lights in the whole city.

  11. Did’nt mention Shola and Ranger & Best in the clearout as we still need backup until we sign a decent young striker or two.
    Plus perhaps i shouldda included Obertan, hey we all make mistakes, it’s the admitting it and moving them on, like Arry does that counts.

  12. Workey
    Surely you mean “Ho Chi Min” city, yes i remember Saigon well, but it no longer exists, like the piaster or “333” brand beer
    Spent many a pleasant afternoon/evening on the veranda of the “The Continental Hotel” that and the more francophone “Hotel Caravel” plus dining in some of the best restuarants in Asia.
    I dont believe things have changed that much, as Saigon had a very entrepreneurial attitude, not suited to a Marxist economy.
    Strange how things work out and how wrong people can be.
    The US worrying about the “Domino Effect” and Ho chi Min wanting to establish a Marxist economy throughout the entire country.
    So what do we have now ?
    Appears apart from The workers paradise of North Korea, every other Asian Nation including Viet Nam, has decided that capitlism is the new way forward.
    Go figure.

  13. chuck says:
    February 29, 2012 at 3:20 pm

    “We couldda had Vertonghen for the price we paid fo Cisse, but appears he is now set on a move to Spurs.”

    Vertonghen wasn’t going to be sold in January, unless perhaps it was one of those January madness things like Carroll or Torres and they’re forwards, which is different. Summer will be the time for him Chuck.

  14. chuck says:
    February 29, 2012 at 4:05 pm

    Surely you mean “Ho Chi Min” city, yes i remember Saigon well, but it no longer exists,”

    Chuck, it’s like Geordies with SJP over there. I know what you mean, Ho Chi Minh City has been the “official” name for some time, but most people still call it Saigon.

  15. chuck says:
    February 29, 2012 at 4:05 pm

    “plus dining in some of the best restuarants in Asia.”

    ” I dont believe things have changed that much, as Saigon had a very entrepreneurial attitude, not suited to a Marxist economy.”

    Aye, correct. You can still get a canny bit of French scran out there if you know where to look. I’ve been to a couple of canny French restaurants in Cambodia too.

    Of course, South East Asians have always been supreme traders. I always used to say that if China bacame a capitalist state, Europe and the US had better watch out because China would be like eight or nine Japans. A case of “be careful what you wish for.” Of course you have this strange situation of communist capitalism there now too.

  16. Yeah, I well remember listening to radio Bejing, during the late sixties, it was highly entertaining.
    With it’s Marxist termonology, like “Capitalist Roaders”, “Wall St. warmongers and their running dogs”
    “Revanchist regimes” etc.
    Mao’s great leap forward was in full swing and the world was divided between Capitalism and Socialism and the outcome was in doubt.
    Of course Hoxtas Radio Tirana was by far the most entertaining, being that Albania made China look like a capitalist roader, they being so far to the left.
    In fact none of these regimes were truly Marxist in nature, more often than not run by dictators who’s knowledg of Marxism was at best vague.
    What Nixon was unaware of in his attempt to reach a certain detant with China, was that in fact it was the the first step at awakening a sleeping giant and opening a Pandora’s Box.
    It should be obvious to all that simply by economy of scale , China and possibly India, with their massive populations will eventually become dominant future powers in the world.
    Which raises the question, why is the UK still providing foreign aid to India ?

  17. chuck says:
    February 29, 2012 at 4:57 pm

    “Of course Hoxtas Radio Tirana was by far the most entertaining, being that Albania made China look like a capitalist roader, they being so far to the left.”

    :lol: I used to listen on SW radio quite a few years back and I know exactly what you mean Chuck!

    I know that “the war” is still a sensitive subject over there to those who fought in it, but did you know that MacNamara fought it on the principle of “game theory” which devised by a paranoid schizophrenic working at the RAND corporation? John Nash, the fella who was portraued by Russell Crowe in that film called “A Beautiful Mind?” – It wasn’t a beautiful mind at all. Neither was Kissinger’s for that matter.

    I also had a friend who once saw MacNamara and “Hanoi” Jane Fonda kissing and making up at the Hay on Wye book festival over here.

    “Which raises the question, why is the UK still providing foreign aid to India ?”

    They would say it was to help the people over there rather than the government, as India has the more people living below the poverty line than any other country, though they also have the largest “middle class” too. Of course to the cynical it could also be some kind of quid pro quo for trade with one of the two biggest developing giants, and of course, we have alot of history over there!

  18. Chuck, on China it was Deng Xiaoping and Hu Yaobang who kicked off all the market reforms after Mao. Hu Yaobang had alot of enemies withing the Maoist old guard and it was his death which kicked off the Tiananmen Square demonstrations and subsequent massacre.

  19. Kissinger uh huh!
    Yeah lives quite near me,I was in Chile a matter of weeks before the shit hit the fan and Allende was offed.
    Seems the US Navy was on manoeuvers with the Chilean Navy at the time(took them out of the equation)and allowed the other two services to take care of business.
    Sure Mac & Jane, The best and the brightest and the not too bright, hopefully Mack had guilt for the rest of his life, doubt if Jane has yet to realises what it was all about.
    As for Kissinger, the ultimate puppet master, who’s vision of world affairs was indistputable then.
    However wonder how he feels about things now?

  20. “…Nixon & Kissinger, should be tried for war crimes…”-the Pop Group!

    Nixon is a reiver name, so is from around the borders area.

  21. Yes I’m aware of the role Deng played, a favorite of Cho En Lai and the ultimate survivor.
    And you are right to a degree, the real manipulator of change was in fact Cho, who was never at heart anti US.
    He also was heavily involved in the Nixon initiative, understanding that the system had to change.
    That the excesses of the cultural revolutin were simply a result of frustration and distraction within an unworkable system.
    There was lots going on at the time and everything was not quite what it appeared on the surface, within the party.

  22. CLiNT FLiCK says:
    February 29, 2012 at 5:33 pm

    “It’s a way of staying ‘in’ with our future ‘masters’.”

    Clint, producers who get richer become consumers like Europe and the US. Whilst the new powers can make everyday things which we couldn’t hope to compete with, they still can’t make stuff like Rolls Royce jets and Eurofighter Typhoons (and the American equivalents).

    Another phenomenom of this changing world is that London has taken over from New York as the world’s biggest banking and services hub, and the UK has moved to a large extent from being a manufacturing economy to a Londoncentric banking and financial services economy. It’s no coincidence that London is at the midway point between the old giant, the US, and the new one, Asia. Of course, many people in the North east and elsewhere know what ructions this change of balance caused under that horrible woman, Mrs. T. The big mistake was that all a people who used to earn their crusts doon the mines and in the shipyards were eventually shoved into places like call centres and ended up competing with places like India when technology changed the game. Germany has a better approach, engineering and innovation of the highest quality like the Rolls Royce example I cited above. It’s not so much things like Mercs and BMWs though, it’s more the fine engineering which makes quality brands such as those.

    Oh aye! football! :-)

  23. In fact, countrys like Israel, Singapore, Ireland, Switzerland, though comparitively small, are successfull and understand what it takes to stay ahead of the curve.
    A highly educated workforce, combined by a low business tax and the ability to repatriate free of any or at least a small exit tax on profits.
    It’s somewhat ironic, that the country who began the industrial revolution, who introduced railroads to the world, have to now buy trains from elsewhere and who have former colonies buy up brand names such as Land Rover/ Jaguar/ MG due to the de industrialisation of the Thatcher era.
    Anyone advocating that Korea would produce more home branded cars and be the worlds second largest producer of ships in the late 50’s would have been given a one way ticket to Cox Lodge.
    Theres not a hell of a lot left in the manufacturing business R/Royce, the arms industry, big oil.
    The rest is mostly financial services, with London being the center and all those dodgy small Island colonies, Turks and Caicos, Bermuda, Gibralter, even former colonies, Bahamas, taking care of the not so legitimate business.
    Not to discount the tax havens of IOM and Jersey.
    As things stand the increasing difference in income, between the workin/ middle class and the wealthy cannot be ignored
    The situation is the same in in the US, export entire industries and rely on a service industry and financial flim flam from Wall st., it’s shamefull and criminal in nature, thats why there’s an occupy Wall St. Movement and an increase in labor membership.
    I’m afraid Labor looks a bit moribund as a party in the UK and with further devolution, possibly Wales & Scotland, is there any thing positive on the horizon.
    That is apart from the possibility of a European spot for NUFC.
    Ah Well, the only constant is change!

  24. I’m coming back Chuck, I’m still way back on Kissinger. Just gotta get some urgent work and a quick meeting done first!

    Sorry Clint I will get back on to Toon in Europe eventually. ;-)

    In the meantime, I think we should all welcome the new blogger!

  25. Although The Irish Republic is, like the rest of Europe and the US in deep shit due to excessive greed.
    All is not lost and the original plan is still viable.
    While certain countries begin their industrialization by producing T-Shirts and sneakers, gradually, not unlike Korea and eventually Developing the Samsung’s and other state of the art manufacture.
    Ireland began with education system, which was always a fairly decent system to begin with, by adding an ever increasing third level tier, that and attrcting high value added industries and ignoring heavy industry in a post industrial age.
    Which some seem to be advocating here for the UK.(by bring back the smokestack industries)
    The combination of a highly educated workforce, with a low business tax, brought many US companies to the Island.
    Whereas it took 36 job interviews in the US to fill a position it took a mere four in Ireland.
    The combination of having free entry to the European Union, a small tax bill, no labor problems and virtually a dollar profit for each dollar invested, resulted in one of the most dynamic changes, the once poor relations of the two islands, now an example for others to emulate.
    That is of course before everyone wanted an overpriced home and a condo in the sun and a Bimmer, etc. etc.
    But the economy is still around One% growth rate and jobs are still being added, but it will unfortunately take time to pay off the accrued debt and in the meantime countries like Australia, Canada and in fact the UK will benefit from the migration of a young and educated workforce.

  26. All my Irish mates say Ireland is a building preserved in aspic right now.
    Most english (not me btw) wouldn’t welcome a workforce from anywhere, educated or not, mate.
    We’ve got the old tory standard ‘english jobs for the english, on low wages thing going again.
    The jingoism will be flying by the time the jubilee street parties & olympics kick off too.
    Can’t wait, NOT!

  27. How! Clint! Have you ever seen this?

    Legs and Co dancing to Wayne County and the Electric Chairs’ “If you don’t wanna f*ck me, f*ck off!” on TOTP. Introduced by DLT.


  28. worky,


    No, i can honestly say i have never seen that before.
    That has to be a chop job, that didn’t happen did it?


  29. CLiNT FLiCK says:
    February 29, 2012 at 10:18 pm

    “No, i can honestly say i have never seen that before.
    That has to be a chop job, that didn’t happen did it?”

    I was doubtful myself, that’s one of the reasons I was asking you. Subsequent investigaetion have proved that it was indeed a “chop job.”

    I remember now I’ve found out. the original dancing was for “Chanson d’Amour” by Manhattan Transfer. Do you remember that one where they danced round all the Labradors to Gilbert O’Sillivan’s “Get Down?” That was a classic! :lol:

  30. “Thank f*ck for Punk!” most of them look like middle-aged washed-up winos now, or perhaps they allways were.
    My God, Davey Jones dead! Boy do I sometimes feel old!
    What did you do in the sixties grandad? Survived son, survived!

  31. “engineering and innovation of the highest quality like the Rolls Royce” – my brother was an engineer for Rolls Royce and was given his redundancy in shares.
    Years later we looked at a neat 2nd hand Mercedes and were discussing it in the club – and one of my treasured memories is when he silenced the bar by saying
    “I’m going to have to sell some of my Rolls Royce shares if I want that Mercedes”
    – the look on peoples’ faces was priceless!

  32. Supermac says:
    March 1, 2012 at 10:40 am

    “Thank f*ck for Punk!” most of them look like middle-aged washed-up winos now”

    So do I Supermac.

  33. chuck says:
    February 29, 2012 at 7:55 pm

    Right! Where was I? Why aye, Cho En Lai Chuck, fair point.

    I used to correspond with someone who was a Green Beret in the Vietnam war, I used to give him advice on web stuff and such. He was doing Kissinger’s dirty work in Cambodia. He was seconded by the CIA to assassinate the then Prince (later King) Sihanouk and spread black terror, but subsequently ended up being (almost) framed for murder, but Muhammad Ali’s lawyer got him off in the end by proving that the victim, a triple agent he was working with was shot from outside the car he and the vistim were both travelling in at the time of the shooting. Now his story would make one hell of a Hollywood movie!

    Kissinger dropped so many bombs on Cambodia and Laos that he took a few inches off the height of ’em! Best part of a million killed and they weren’t even at war with the US. It was shennangans like that which led to the rise of Commie Pol Pot and even more deaths. Counterproductive “Blowback”.

    There’s a helluva lot of difference between those coutries but I take the general point. The richest, and often the most equal countries of all tend to be small European countries and pricipalities from the likes of Switzerland (Gnomes of Zurich and very fine craftsmanship), Norway (Oil), Denmark (top end goods and services) down to tiny banking / tax dodging principalities such as Lieschenstein and Luxembourg. Singapore’s a rich country, a kind of small enclave of former colonial wealth) but very strict. They hang you for all sorts out there. Never wanted to touch that place with a bargepole! Israel doesn’t fall into that group at all in terms of per capita wealth.

    As you may have heard Chuck, there’s a bit of a problem with the “Eurozone” ATM. The thing is that there are two, or even three Europes, and as I could’ve telt the daft gets, they have been way too ambitious in trying to unite them too fast monetarily. They are too different and they went too far too fast.

    Firstly, you have the rich, beer drinking, primarily Protestant coutries of Northern Europe. Germany, UK, The Scandinavian group, the “Benelux” group (Netherlands, Belgium and Luxembourg) and so on.

    Then you have the Southern, primarily Catholic wine gluggers such as Greece (aye, they’re Orthodox religiously), Italy, Spain and so on. Lovely food, lovely buildings, lovely art, nice quality of life but not as productive generally, more chaotic and with more economic problems.

    The third grouping are the former Commie, largely Slavic countries of the East whose economies are still rising from decades of Communism and were way behind.

    Then there are the exceptions. France is undoubtedly one of the first group economically, but socially it is a kind of mixture of the first two groups.

    Another exception is Ireland which is a Northern country, but thorough history became more Catholic than the Vatican. Perhaps this was partly through Protestant oppression and Catholic solidarity against Protestant settlers, especially after Cromwell and his murderous shennanigans, and of course beyond that. Their economy was less developed than other Northern countries. Partly they were held back through 100s of years of colonisation. I’m not being “perjoritive” of any different cultures BTW, it’s just the diversity of life and the diversity of history. Different strokes… and all that.

    Anyway, in an effort to bring the three groups of economies together, the less well off countries were the beneficiares of huge sums from the richer countries of the first group. Ireland was very defintely one of those beneficiaries, and they used the help to create a low tax haven for business and they became a bit of a “tiger” economy for a while in areas such as software, so much so that Ireland became almost as rich as the very rich small countries in Europe such as Norway and Switzerland. Alas, the balance went too far and it was unsutainable. Iceland was another example which had similarities to Ireland.

    It’s been also been almost unsustainable Southern countries such as Italy, Spain, Portugal, and of course it has been unsustainable for Greece. They cooked their books to get into the Euro in the first place, are highly unproductive, retire at about 30, and are habitual tax dodgers (yes, I am being perjorative there!).

    “Which some seem to be advocating here for the UK.(by bring back the smokestack industries)”

    I’m not advocating it the way you seem to put it Chuck. Now you should be the expert on the US, but in the UK, MrsT. in her battles with the unions in the 80s just let manufacturing go to the wall, throwing many of our eggs into the basket of banking and financial services in general. There’s nothing wrong with manufacturing, but highly developed ecomomies such as the US and the top European nations can’t compete with developing countries on everyday manufacturing, so they should more like Germany, concentrating on high end manufacturing like the “Bimmers” you mentioned, and even more importantly in real terms, the high tech, state of the art stuff that makes the stuff like cars and other things like that more efficiently all over the world including the far east. Thats where Germany wins out in manufacturing.

    But back on topic at last, 70% of voters in the poll so far seem to think that we are gannin’ to be in Europe next year.

  34. Workey
    Yeah we are for the most part, in agreement.
    Of course dont take it that i blame the Irish working classes greed as the main reason for the financial meltdown.
    Though they certainly played a part.
    The real culprits were both Irish bankers and specially created subsiduaries of large European banks, who worked under the Irish banking laws.
    The reason being it would have been illegal for them to have provided the services they did under their own country’s laws.
    Thats the same banks, German, french, Netherlands, Spanish, etc. etc. who are being paid 100 cents on the euro, through a combination of, certain banks purposely switching funds, to show larger balances than they actually owned which in turn caused confusion in the auditing process and an ignorance on the part of the
    Irish government, as to the actual amount owed.
    A difference of approxamatel twenty billion, believe it or not.
    In retrospect it would have been better to default and pay a certain amount on the Euro, but the decision was made and most foreign banks could’nt believe their luck.
    But thats not all, to add insult to injury, those same banks became the holders of the seven percent bonds that were then issued.
    A double killing, is it any wonder the Irish have lost all faith in government?
    It will take at least a decade, to pay off the debts, that is if things dont deteriorate further, in the meantime every one will have to cut their cloth accordingly.